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I've had discussions in which I made the same comment your mother did, but which was dismissed with "Well that's different, because that's normal."

*headdesk*

Poppycock

A lot of young boys have had the experience of being groped by homosexuals.
Have they? I don't think I was ever groped when I was a "young girl" - I was certainly into my teens by the time that started... How many counts as "a lot"? His argument does not strike me as water-tight, irrespective of your mother's point.

And to the previous commenter: yep, know that response....

mythago

Obviously I wasn't at that lecture, Ismone, but having had Dressler as a law professor in the past he's pretty progressive; I'd guess that the reason he used the straight man :: woman analogy is that the average person does really think that men would think being groped is just swell, and was playing off exactly the dynamic HF's mother mentioned.

Antigone

I've heard the "it's normal" argument before. I think it has to do with the fact that girls ARE taught that, (which should make anybody a feminist) and men are taught to be the groper, not the grope-y.

Just because its expectation violation doesn't make it right.

Ismone, I love your name.

Ismone

Antigone--Thank you, and you were right, you know. Being older doesn't mean being wiser. I should have helped you bury the bodies.

Mythago--I agree with you that he is really progressive. I didn't go to the lecture thinking that we would disagree about anything. But he really meant his example, and he wasn't willing to consider the role reversal. Other students pressed him on it after me, and he was not backing down. I just don't think he'd looked at it from that perspective before, which was a little irresponsible. On the other hand, though, when I'd way in on civil rights issues in certain classes (when my civil rights were not at issue) I'm sure I've said things that are a little irresponsible as well.

The Happy Feminist

Metal Mozart, my issue with my father's comment was that he was not merely describing a prevalent point of view in our culture but (subtly) endorsing it as well.

mythago

Ismone, not disagreeing with you; I'm just wondering if his motivation was to avoid having Neanderthal types in the class think "Oh, hell, we men LUVVIT when a hot babe grabs us" and then shutting off their minds smugly.

Ismone

No, he was shutting me down and moving on to another questioner. When other students pressed him on the issue later, he was unwilling to either explain why the gay man got to be the straight man, and the straight man the woman, or to agree that flipping the analogy would be a worthwhile exercise. He just shut down. Great guy, looks like he as at least one blind spot.

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