DATING ETIQUETTE

I am very stressed out today due to work issues, so I thought I would tackle a light hearted subject -- dating etiquette.  The following tips are framed in heterosexual terms because they are meant to help clear up the confusion arising from the evolution away from traditional heterosexual dating practices, but they can certainly apply to same-sex couples as well.

1. Either party can initiate the date.  I encourage women to take the initiative.  Sure, you risk the embarrassment of being rejected but you may be surprised at how flattered and pleased the man turns out to be.  Ane even if he doesn't go out with you, you have at least taken matters into your own hands rather than waiting around hoping to be noticed.

2. When you ask someone out, be specific as to when the proposed date is to occur.  It is correct to ask "Do you want to go to a movie on Thursday night?"  NOT: "Do you want to go to a movie sometime?"  The problem with the invitation to go out "sometime" is that you put the other person in the position of possibly having to say, "No, I NEVER want to go out with you."  If you choose a specific time, the person can say, "No, I have other plans Thursday night."  That answer is far less embarrassing both for you and the other person.

3. If you ask a person out twice, and that person says no both times, stop asking.  (Maybe you can push it to three times but after that, basta.)  If the other person wants to go out with you, he or she can always say, "Well, I can't make it Thursday but how about Saturday?"  If someone keeps telling you no, respect that person's autonomy and back off.

4. Whoever initiates the date pays.  If the woman asks, she pays.  The invitee, male or female, may make a gesture towards paying but the invitor should insist on footing the bill.  The invitee should gracefully allow the invitor to pay even if the invitee is a man and the invitor is a woman.  A man who insists on paying when the woman did the inviting is (in the words of Leon Kass) essentially insisting that the date occur on his terms.

5. What about gestures of chivalry by the man, such as opening the door for the woman?  Either way, whatever makes the man more comfortable, is fine. The key question the woman should be asking herself, however, is not: "Is he willing to engage in symbolic gestures of chivalry?" but "Does he appear to respect my opinions, my interests, and my autonomy?"

Comments

[Seeker6079]

Wow. Three months and no posts. Jeez, HF, has everbody got this so down pat that they don't need helpful advice? I doubt it.

[The Happy Feminist]

I actually got an email from someone who thought it was helpful!

[Chalicechick]

When I was helping teach a post-op transsexual to appear more womanlike, holding the door was a surprisingly significant issue.

It WAS in the South, but still...

CC

[Sarah]

"Either way, whatever makes the man more comfortable, is fine."

"Making him comfortable" is one of those things I am pretty damned tired of hearing. How about he just takes responsibility for how he feels instead? Otherwise, I suppose I see what you are saying, except it's really only limited to the "asking for a date" stage of dating...

[ronnie]

Now i understand about the whole paying for the date issue. I would never think about trying to control a woman buy paying. I didn't know that's how women saw it. I have to say that i do like to open doors. To me it's a show of respect. But from what I've just read, it sounds like women could care less wether i do it or not. Is that true? You would think a 23 year old would know more about this.

[ronnie]

Oh yeah and since I never get asked out, I will most likely always be the one paying. Which is fine and also is cool if she asks me out and she pays.

[The Happy Feminist]

This post is meant to be a discussion of what I think dating etiquette should be. That's not to say reality has caught up.

Lots (or probably most) women still wait to be asked out. (And I should note that it can be hard for women to ask men out because men sometimes still assume that a woman who does the initiating is desperate or slutty.) Lots of women looooove having doors opened for them (but many don't care for it at all). Lots of women expect the man to always pay for a date. Expectations in this area are in flux, so there are no hard and fast rules, unfortuntately.

I urge women to initiate dates and pay for them. I urge men to let women pay for dates if they want to. I urge women who are dislike the door opening custom to be tolerant of it. I urge women and men to not place to much emphasis on the door-opening thing. (If you open a door for me, I will say thank you and likely think you are a nice person who is trying to be polite, but it's not the be-all and end-all. It doesn't entitle you to anything. It's just a minor, polite gesture.)

You sound like you are laid-back, respectful, and able to go with the flow. I think you'll probably do fine.

[T.A.B.]

I liked this post and hope women will consider your advice.

[swan]

I'm coming late to the party, I know...

On the door-opening thing: generally, if it's more convenient for me to open the door (I'm closer, the handle is on my side, etc), I will open the door. It's politeness and respect. If someone else opens the door, I smile and say "thank you" graciously, taking it as a gesture of respect.

I think we could do worse than to provide small gestures like this for each other...

[Bird's Eye View]

He, this is reasonable.

And yet...it appears not so for some of the fanatical estrogen junkies here. Krist, what's wrong with making each other feel comfortable, if it matters not to you either way, SARAH? A date is not a WAR, jeezus. At least not to the rest of the world... With that attitude, why even go out on a date in the first place???